FBI to probe deputy shooting of California 13-year-old who had pellet gun
SAN FRANCISCO – The Federal Bureau of Investigation is conducting an independent investigation of the fatal shooting of a popular 13-year-old boy by a sheriff’s deputy in Northern California.
Sheriff Steve Freitas said in a statement Friday afternoon that he will cooperate fully with federal investigators and welcomes their participation in the probe of Andy Lopez’s killing on Tuesday afternoon. The shooting has generated numerous protests and marches in the suburban town of Santa Rosa, with many residents questioning the deputy’s decision to fire on the youth.
Freitas also expressed sympathy to the Lopez family and thanked the Santa Rosa community for keeping protests peaceful.
Police say Lopez was carrying a pellet gun that looked like an AK-47 assault rifle. Fox News
This is the *Toy Gun*, the replica AK-47 that Andy Lopez was carrying.
This is a REAL AK-47.
Can YOU tell the difference? No? Don’t feel bad about it, I can’t either.
A timeline released Thursday by the Santa Rosa police shows that only 10 seconds passed from the moment that the sheriff’s deputy and his partner called dispatch to report a suspicious person to the moment they called back to say shots had been fired.
At full cyclic rate, an AK-47 can fire about 600 rounds per minute. SOURCE
Did you catch that? 600 rounds per minute!
To all of those ignorant people complaining about how the Officers fired too soon I say this; in that 10 second window between the 1st radio traffic and *shots fired* this *kid*, had the gun been REAL, could have emptied a 30 round magazine in the direction of the Officers and been well into a 2nd magazine if he had put any planning or forethought into his actions whatsoever.
*Oh but Fred, he was just a 13 year old kid, he didn’t know what he was doing*…
That excuse will NOT work with me or anyone else that has ever been involved with the military or police and security work, especially if that security work was in Iraq or Afghanistan. These people will tell you, as will ANY Veteran with WAR experience; a 13 year old *kid* will kill you faster than an adult.
Anyone that’s ever been a street cop, Detective, Narcotics Agent, whatever the case may be, they too will tell you the same thing, a kid with a gun is more dangerous than an adult. You see, a KID at that age has no REAL WORLD experience and as far as they are concerned, after you get shot, shoot someone, blow them up or the like, you just hit the re-set button and play the game all over again.
That’s NOT how it works in the REAL WORLD, and I say this in good conscience; if I had been one of those Officers, if I had been there WITH those Officers and had seen that *replica* of an AK-47 being raised and swung in MY general direction, I’d have shot the little cretin too.
But you see, in all reality, an Officer has a split second to make a *life or death* decision, the shooting board, Internal Affairs and the FBI can take years to analyze the Officers’ actions. I hope these Officers come out well in their investigation and if they are proven to be in the right they need to never hear another single word of condemnation from anyone.
Somehow, I sense that these Officers did what they had to do, but the *bleeding heart* Police Haters in the neighborhood only want to see the Officers suffer for their actions.
Believe me when I say this; these Officers, and many like them, may not be *suffering* in the traditional sense of the word but there will never be another day go by, for as long as they live, that they don’t re-live this shooting or see the *kid* in their dreams.
I also want to say, I really am sorry that Andy Lopez died like this, being shot to death over a *TOY GUN*, but I am extremely happy that the Officers weren’t shot and killed had it not been a *TOY GUN*.
Sad state our country is in these days…When I was 13, I could walk down the street carrying a real firearm…and did many times on…If the S/O or another LEO saw me, only thing they would say is, “Nice gun, kid!” The thugs and gang bangers have caused to police to become more survival orientated…Don’t think I would have shot the kid or even pulled my sidearm back then confronted with the same situation….but its a different world today, unfortunately…Wouldn’t want to wear a badge many places…just isn’t the same…
Ron, we lived in South Mansfield, we’d go over to the old gravel pits to shoot, swim, hunt doves in season and just generally have a good time, and none of the Officers, Local, Parish or State said a thing other than to comment on what you were carrying..
Most of them knew me because my father was the local gunsmith but still, it was a different time and place, we would have stood side by side WITH the Officers if the ship hit the sand…
That was then, this is now.
Kids with guns pose an issue that adults with guns do not: cops realize that kids have little if any sense of mortality or reality. Raised on video games many kids think that Life can consist of one large Reset Button. Because of this I had to reconcile, up front, that I would and could drop the hammer on a child every bit as readily if not more so than an adult.
Anyone, anyone at all, doubt that the above “pellet gun” looks pretty much PRECISELY as the real AK?
Any movement of that rifle’s barrel towards me, on the street, following an order to drop the firearm at least once, would result in an event similar to that of the one we’re discussing now.
BZ
Another officer will NOW have to live with the killing of a young man who had a toy gun..
On tbe surface it apprears that the OBAMA regime has ordered the FBI to investigate the officer who in my opinion acted properly.. As a police officer for 28 years this is one scenario that you prayed daily that you would never face….in my 28 years I was fortunate to have never faced this situation..
This officer will have to live with tbis most unfortunate incident…and if investigated properly the case should be closed as a justifiable homicide…because that is exactly what it was….”JUSTIFIED.. However this officer will be labled as a child killer..what do you expect for officers to do….walk down and examine the weapon before hand…I think not..
The one thing an officer thinks about before he leaves on patrol is to try and do everything possible to come home to your family in one piece..
In all honesty I would have done the same…why you ask…because my family means more to me than anything and I will not allow anyone or anything to get in the way of me going home safe and sound. .
Yes it was a horrible incident but there is no way anyone can expect the officer to have acted any differently…..
Put yourself in tbe officers position..are you going to allow anyone to DRAW DOWN on you with what appears to be a real AK47…I do not think so..if this person refuses to cooperate with instructions to drip the weapon, he is that much closer to being DEAD…it is what it is..
The officer should be cleared immediately without any interference from the OBAMA REGIME…but that may be more than what can be expected. …Holder no doubt will push for this officers head…
Just keep tuned in to the news at 10 and expect to see this officer crucified……
If this officer is indicted by the feds, you will know it is HOLDER pulling the strings..
Bingo… Direct hit on ALL counts!
So..? Does he have to go before a shooting board Fred?
Well Fred, had this happen to me when on the patrol years ago.
Damn near shot the youngster.
Today, I would have 100%.
Toy guns, both pistols and rifles, pellet guns look and even cycle like the real ones.
This world has changed.
Lots of hold-ups are committed with these replicas.
So, if the person holding this replica is stupid enough to point this toy at a real police officer, and the police officer responds by shooting and killing this “yout”, ,, well SO BE IT.
It is a justified homicide. Period
Sorry, you bleeding bastard liberal assholes.
Read the laws.
And another voice of experience heard from! Thank you Mr. Chuck, and every word is correct!
I agree with what you are all saying about it being such a different world. No respect at all for any kind of authority. How many times have we read about a young person being shot and it turns out they had a realistic toy weapon? So why not drop it in a second when police tell them to? I do not know anyone in law enforcement personally but I’ve always felt they have the right to protect their lives. You can’t go check if the weapon is real or not and then decide what to do. Although all these protesters seem to expect that. Fine if it is a “toy” but not so great if it is the real thing.
Exactly! I am so glad to see that you *get it*…
I haven’t been able to dig up any details regarding the interaction between the cops and the kid. Did he refuse an order drop the weapon? I don’t know. If he did the officer(s) were justified. Did he point the gun at them? Don’t know. I don’t believe that an officer would just shoot him on sight with no provocation. Lord only knows what the media will do with this incident.
As to the 600 rd/minute (10 rds/second) cyclic rate, that refers to a military full auto AK. AK’s sold to civilians are semi-auto and do not have that rate of fire. They’ll still kill you though.
The order to drop the weapon was given, earlier stories documented that and the kid turning and raising the weapon…
Do you honestly believe that there are no full auto AK-47′s on the streets of this nation? Seriously? If you do, you need to get out more… I can take you to East Dallas and in less than 20 minutes have you *hooked up*, weapon, magazines, ammo and all..
If we’re going to talk LEGAL weapons you are very correct but it’s rare for a Cop to face LEGAL weapons..
BTW, there ARE fully automatic AK-47s and AK-74s and their variants — Valmet and etc — on the streets. And they are not complicated to modify. My team has encountered two in the past year, both passed the semi/full auto test.
They exist.
BZ
Drop in kits are still available fro them BZ. One screw driver, and three little pieces of metal…
Yup. Found this in a Santa Rosa newspaper.
“The deputy said the teen didn’t comply with commands to drop the gun and was turning toward the deputies while raising the barrel.” Therefore it’s a justifiable shooting.
As to auto vs. full auto AK weapons on the street, that was not my point. My point was that the 600rd/minute rate applies only to the full auto version. I’m well aware that there are full auto versions of most military style rifles in civilian hands. Several of my friends legally own such weapons. (We have a Class 3 dealer here in my home town.) The majority of them are legally purchased with all the appropriate licensing and paperwork. Our local range has an “auto shoot” every summer. As to the situation in Dallas that you refer to, don’t think your geographic location is unique. You might want inform Eric Holder of the gravity of your situation there just north of Mexico. Hook him up.
Eric Holder is a screwed up ass kissing Obama Boy…
And I know, it’s not just East Dallas, you can get FULL AUTO guns in ANY major city, and I DO understand about Class 3 dealers and legal arms, you can be confident in that, but as I said, in most instances the Cops don’t face LEGAL guns and LEGAL owners…
If an Officer on the street sees an AK-47 in the hands of some moron like this *kid* he doesn’t have time to ascertain if it’s REAL or not, he can’t take time to consider *is it a semi-auto* and is this kid the LEGAL owner, gang-bangers have the full autos and they will USE them in a heartbeat, if the Officer hesitates he may damn well be DEAD in less than a second.
And the gang-bangers may have weapons that were obtained from a LEGAL source, they probably stole em, but hey, legal, illegal, it’s just semantics.. Right?
Only one thing I want to say. I want to say Thank You to all the folks here who were or are police officers. Thank you for putting your lives on the line for the rest of us. Thank you for watching over my family while I was deployed overseas. Thank you for making my job and life a lot easier. Thank you for the job you do for all of us.
I think we’ve covered this before, but it bears repeating. Police officers have to make split-second decisions, with lives weighing in the balance. When they arrived on the scene and saw this young man pointing a weapon at them, they had to react. It’s what they are trained to do. In most situations, if they do not react, people will die. Maybe even them. As far as I am concerned, the officers did the only thing they could do.
The kid turning and lifting the barrel toward the officers may have been an involuntary action due to him not being too safety conscious. But we’ll never know.
I would have acted in the same manner as that deputy given the same circumstances and I say with some certainty that I’m glad today that I was never put in a situation like found himself in.
Years ago, I remember taking a 12 year old kid home from school who had taken a replica Colt .45 semi-auto to class and was menacing other kids with it. I gave him a lecture in front of his father of how I would have been justified in shooting him in self - defense if I had come across that boy and his toy gun on the street.
I feel so sorry for that kid’s parents.
“The kid turning and lifting the barrel toward the officers may have been an involuntary action due to him not being too safety conscious. But we’ll never know.”
If this were one of MY troops doing this, I would support him or her to the fullest. It’s not their job to channel The Amazing Kreskin. It’s their job to, when necessary, make things stop. See my top comment. Kids first, everyone.
BZ
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For fun, we would load up and go to trash dumps and shoot rats during moonlight nights. Those days are long gone. We had a healthy respect for guns, and law enforcement. Never ever point a gun at someone. A sad story.
I’ve said it on (many) more than one occasion: “Bullets that come out of guns fired by women and kids-come out at THE SAME speed as those that come out of a gun fired by a (man) crook!”
I pray for the officers involved and THEIR families!
Imagine instead that the officers were driving full speed to stop a crime and on the way ran over and killed this kid. Same regrettable result just without a gun and we would all sigh and shrug that bad stuff happens. My impression is that it sounds like one of those justified shootings where in the performance of their duties, it cost someone their life.
Now, note that I just got done lambasting the police on another blog for pointing their rifle at someone without sufficient cause. So, while I respect the police, I recognize there are bad apples and mistakes do happen. We live in an imperfect world.
If someone pointed a realistic firearm at me, I would treat it as a lethal threat.
I don’t have a problem blasting off if I believe a Cop is wrong, and hell yes, there ARE bad apples, but this was not one of those cases… Great comment, and yes, I would have fired too…
Hmm… Okay Fred. I’m going to throw in a twist on this. Have to…
Liberals are so pissed because some upstanding Officer did his job. Which happened to involve a teenager, and an AK. Right?
Now, what well known super liberal shot a teenager that was running away from him, in the back, that was carrying an AK? And then, put himself in for a Silver Star, complete with a “Combat V Device?”
Lurch..